AVSIG: ATP requirements may be reduced wwswsigarch.jpg (7236 bytes)

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AVSIG Discussion Sections >> Training & Proficiency

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Russell Holton
AVSIG Member


Reged: 07/07/05
Posts: 14136
Re: ATP requirements may be reduced [Re: Bob Dubner]
      #444822 - 11/13/17 02:57 PM

Quote:

I spent the rest of the day occasionally mulling over just how happy I'd be, if I ever needed CPR, if the person delivering it had been certified by a computer program. Oh, well. I suppose I wouldn't actually refuse it. But, still.




I'm pretty sure it's something to keep the bureaucrats happy. You didn't describe why your sister needed the certificate. It's probably something where someone deemed it a "good idea" if a number of people in a location/occupation had some knowledge of CPR besides what's shown on TV. The certificate indicates that said person has some knowledge beyond what Hollywood shows.

A practice dummy would be better, but a well-done computer questionnaire would be better than nothing. In this case, it's a renewal, so it may be to go over some knowledge items (when, how fast, what else needs to be done, etc.)


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Ward Miller POU-NY
Top Gun


Reged: 05/05/04
Posts: 10508
Loc: New York
ATP requirements may be reduced [Re: Terry Carraway]
      #444824 - 11/13/17 05:24 PM

Terry, we usually have about a 4-minute window. Get them breathing and the
heart working in that time and the outcome is likely going to be favorable.
Much longer than that and the damage to the brain is often beyond reversing.


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Richard Duxbury (Dux)
Top Gun


Reged: 05/15/04
Posts: 5468
Loc: Minneapolis/Tucson
Re: ATP requirements may be reduced [Re: Dave Siciliano (ADS)]
      #444853 - 11/14/17 10:30 PM

This was a big discussion item during the ALPA Air Safety Forum this summer in DCA. At that time, National ALPA wanted to keep the much higher (than ICAO/etc.) standards. Some of the panel also presented some potential future problems for the USA airlines if we did not come closser to ICAO recommendations.

Others noted that it was not just a safety concern -and could be modified for a reasonable approach to new pilot hiring.

Even now, the USA standards are MUCH higher than the rest of the international aviation commercial pilot hiring and flying.

OK, did United and other airlines hire 300 hour pilots in 1965 era? Even paid for some of their training?

Like Randy, I could soon know if a pilot was a "good" pilot, whether military or otherwise. Not all (but MOST) were very good pilots.

Regards,

Dux -OK, I did not tell the truth about the cold sleet and weather in Tucson. Thinking back to the Northwest crew parking lot in 1996- where after a 11 day trip you could not find your snow covered car with a dead battery.

Nope, sunny and perhaps a record warm day today in Tucson.


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Randy Sohn
Gradn Exlated Ordre of teh Fyling Fingres


Reged: 08/31/01
Posts: 23187
Loc: Savage, MN - U.S.A.
Re: ATP requirements may be reduced [Re: Richard Duxbury (Dux)]
      #444867 - 11/15/17 03:32 PM

Quote:

OK, did United and other airlines hire 300 hour pilots in 1965 era?.




Yup, wish now that I'da kept a few of those ads that I saw.

Come t think of it, that made me recall something else, a MUCH earlier era in Untidy's history - the "Tracy Aces".

best, randy

Edited by Randy Sohn (11/15/17 03:35 PM)


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Jeff Hartmann CIC
Top Gun


Reged: 05/18/04
Posts: 7323
Loc: Chico,CA
Re: ATP requirements may be reduced [Re: Randy Sohn]
      #444887 - 11/15/17 10:12 PM

I think they advertised that they would hire Private Pilots and train them. Rumor has it they only did that with one PP. I wish I could check that.

--------------------
Jeff

nothing clever to say right now...


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Randy Sohn
Gradn Exlated Ordre of teh Fyling Fingres


Reged: 08/31/01
Posts: 23187
Loc: Savage, MN - U.S.A.
Re: ATP requirements may be reduced [Re: Jeff Hartmann CIC]
      #444905 - 11/16/17 12:08 PM

Quote:

Rumor has it they only did that with one PP.




Chuckle, <nsl>

best, randy


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Scott Dunham (RDU)
Top Gun


Reged: 04/29/04
Posts: 6470
Loc: Chapel Hill, NC
Re: ATP requirements may be reduced [Re: Richard Duxbury (Dux)]
      #444983 - 11/19/17 12:37 AM

>> 300 hour PP...

One of my Filipino-ancestry friends got hired by UAL around 1978 with 500 hours of mostly C150 time, an IR, and a wet MEL ticket. They were under a minority hiring push (with evidently some reason, having virtually zero of anything other than white male pilots...) and hes flying B777s now. The boy done good after some sidesaddle time, a couple of furloughs, and losing most of his pension money in there somewhere. It worked out.


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Richard Duxbury (Dux)
Top Gun


Reged: 05/15/04
Posts: 5468
Loc: Minneapolis/Tucson
Re: ATP requirements may be reduced [Re: Scott Dunham (RDU)]
      #445090 - 11/21/17 11:59 AM

Thanks Scott -yes that is a good example. The loss of pilot pensions came from some chapter 11 stuff -varied by airline. The UAL pilots spent a big portion of their pension funds in a stupid employee buyout attempt. Thus in chapter 11, the judge agreed that their pension was bust.

Delta pilots seeing a possible chapte 11 coming, -many taking early retirement and using the lump sum option that was offered. The fund got drained and, yes, chapter 11 judge agreed with the company that the pension must be terminated.(now badly underfunded.)

Northwest pilot group also had a well funded pension fund. Limited lump sum options and when in chapter 11, the judge allowed the pensions to continue (since it was indeed well funded by industry standards). The pensions of working pilots was frozrn at existing rates.

You are correct in your analysis of commercial pilots in the 60's and 70's. White male -many with military experience. Not the case so much today -various age groups (yes some retired military and 44 years old), many more women, -but still hard to find black qualified pilots I think.

Regards,

Dux from Tucson -but holiday season in Minnesota, DCA, and Charlottesville, VA.


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