AVSIG: NPRM RE: Transponder Exception For Gliders wwswsigarch.jpg (7236 bytes)

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Mase Taylor
Top Gun


Reged: 04/29/04
Posts: 9446
Loc: SOCAL
NPRM RE: Transponder Exception For Gliders
      #411538 - 07/04/15 11:15 PM

If I am reading this FAA Notice of Proposed Rule Making correctly, the FAA wants to require gliders to have transponders.

Halfway down the first page, in the middle column.

"SUMMARY:
The FAA requests public
comment on removal of the current
transponder exception for gliders. This
action responds to recommendations
from members of Congress and the
National Transportation Safety Board.
The purpose of this action is to gather
information to determine whether the
current glider exception—from
transponder equipment and use
requirements—provides the appropriate
level of safety in the National Airspace
System."

--------------------
Fly The Airplane As Far Into The Crash As Possible. - Bob Hoover 1922-2016 R.I.P.

Edited by Mase Taylor (07/04/15 11:18 PM)


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Scott Dunham (RDU)
Top Gun


Reged: 04/29/04
Posts: 6470
Loc: Chapel Hill, NC
Re: NPRM RE: Transponder Exception For Gliders [Re: Mase Taylor]
      #411545 - 07/05/15 02:49 AM

They're opening a dialogue with industry and pilots about a potential transponder requirement, along with ADS-B visibility. We wrote them a recommendation letter in something like 2008 asking for a transponder requirement after a midair between a glider and a bizjet. FAA leapt into action several years later after getting pinged by a couple of Congressmen about the same issue. In the meantime, the ADS-B requirement came along, as well as the recently TSOd TABS box that makes an equipped aircraft detectable by other planes carrying either TCAS or ADS-B-In. There is some very lightweight equipment available now that didn't exist only a few years back. Should be some interesting discussion out of this.

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Russell Holton
AVSIG Member


Reged: 07/07/05
Posts: 14136
Re: NPRM RE: Transponder Exception For Gliders [Re: Scott Dunham (RDU)]
      #411546 - 07/05/15 05:39 AM

Quote:

There is some very lightweight equipment available now that didn't exist only a few years back.



What about power requirements? I suspect many of them were designed to go into normal airplanes and so power consumption (within reasonable limits) wasn't a concern. But it can be a big concern when you've only got a battery.


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Jeff Hartmann CIC
Top Gun


Reged: 05/18/04
Posts: 7323
Loc: Chico,CA
Re: NPRM RE: Transponder Exception For Gliders [Re: Scott Dunham (RDU)]
      #411550 - 07/05/15 08:05 AM

>>>> FAA leapt into action several years later <<<<

BaHaaarrr...that's funny! (and sadly true)

on a serious note:

http://jeremy.zawodny.com/blog/archives/007288.html

--------------------
Jeff

nothing clever to say right now...


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Stephanie Belser-2
Top Gun APC


Reged: 04/28/04
Posts: 7139
Loc: KFAM
Re: NPRM RE: Transponder Exception For Gliders [Re: Russell Holton]
      #411551 - 07/05/15 08:39 AM

Quote:

Quote:

There is some very lightweight equipment available now that didn't exist only a few years back.



What about power requirements? I suspect many of them were designed to go into normal airplanes and so power consumption (within reasonable limits) wasn't a concern. But it can be a big concern when you've only got a battery.


And some solar cells, perhaps?

--------------------
If you wish to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first invent the universe.-- Carl Sagan


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Ralph Jones
Top Gun


Reged: 08/31/01
Posts: 21214
Loc: 4CO2
Re: NPRM RE: Transponder Exception For Gliders [Re: Stephanie Belser-2]
      #411552 - 07/05/15 09:00 AM

Yes, some gliders are now getting solar panels.

--------------------
Ralph Jones
LS-4a N49LS 6R


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B. Butler (Oregonian)
Top Gun


Reged: 05/15/04
Posts: 9760
Loc: Ashland, Oregon
Re: NPRM RE: Transponder Exception For Gliders [Re: Russell Holton]
      #411566 - 07/05/15 02:47 PM Attachment (127 downloads)

Quote:


What about power requirements? ...it can be a big concern when you've only got a battery.




--------------------
"Why not be a nihilist? A man has to believe in something."
-Bernie Gunther

Edited by B. Butler (Oregonian) (07/05/15 02:48 PM)


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Russell Holton
AVSIG Member


Reged: 07/07/05
Posts: 14136
Re: NPRM RE: Transponder Exception For Gliders [Re: B. Butler (Oregonian)]
      #411569 - 07/05/15 04:07 PM

Seems manageable. Taken at face value, it suggests a common 7Ah gel cell battery would give you 25 hours of flying time. Seems like an adequate margin to me. <g> Not sure how badly the 6 lb battery would affect things.

One item of concern, it's rated for 14V - which suggests a running engine. It would need to be tested on battery power - possibly have a battery booster added.


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Ralph Jones
Top Gun


Reged: 08/31/01
Posts: 21214
Loc: 4CO2
Re: NPRM RE: Transponder Exception For Gliders [Re: Russell Holton]
      #411571 - 07/05/15 05:00 PM

Quote:

One item of concern, it's rated for 14V - which suggests a running engine. It would need to be tested on battery power - possibly have a battery booster added.




That's true of pretty much every power user in an airplane (or car) with a "12V electric system": a 12V battery wants 13.6 volts from the regulator to maintain a charge. The principal impact of the engine being off is a little less transmit power.

Lots of sailplane pilots, including me, do use a 14V battery for one reason: if you're getting low out on course and your retrieve crew is at home base, you'd like to have all the transmit power you can get. However, I've never seen a controlled test of the benefits.

--------------------
Ralph Jones
LS-4a N49LS 6R


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Terry Carraway
Top Gun


Reged: 06/02/04
Posts: 7098
Loc: Maryland
Re: NPRM RE: Transponder Exception For Gliders [Re: B. Butler (Oregonian)]
      #411614 - 07/06/15 12:53 PM

Quote:

Quote:


What about power requirements? ...it can be a big concern when you've only got a battery.







I wonder how they get 130 watts transmit power, from a 4 watt power input????????

--------------------
Terry
Mostly 0W3


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